Wednesday, February 11, 2009

Post Episode Discussion: This Place Is Death

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144 comments:

t-dot kim said...

Christian Shepherd IS Jacob?

or is the manifestation OF Jacob?

PalmerEldritch said...

i think he's been absorbed/become an aspect of Jacob.

like HAL and Dave in 2061 and 3001.

cuz i'm a nerd.



fun episode. the reveal of Eloise wasn't too shocking or anything. but it was fun to see Montand lose his arm.

and where the heck did he get dragged into? the Temple or something?

and the Frenchies were taken over by the Island or something? or just crazy?? or just Danielle was crazy????

interesting that Daniel goes all Old Ben Kenobi and hangs out on Tatooine/The Island as an old dude.

are our Time-Fuckers stuck in the year they are at now? jumping one last time? returning to 2005? still jumping?

PalmerEldritch said...

malcolm was right. locke's leg was GROSS.

think he'll lose use of his legs when he's back on the mainland? or just have his massively messed up leg that'll need to be surgically repaired or something?

is he thrown in the past likes Andrew's new theory? or straight to "three years later?"

Stephanie said...

Ok, which would hurt worse? Getting your arm pulled off or leg broken with your bone protruding? Cause Montan(sp) didn't make too much of a fuss down in that hole. Where as I felt Lock's pain.
Holli, I did love Locke turning the donkey wheel. But that huge last reveal just made me pissed off. That was the best they could do? Pitiful.
Hopefully that was the last flash we'll see cause they're getting old. Let's move on to something else.

PalmerEldritch said...

which one? our girl Ellie?

memphish said...

The thing about the Ellie reveal is that it shows why the writers shouldn't write so far ahead of the viewers. I'd love to be able to corner them now and put it to them, but then they're busy writing the finale, so I don't think they'd care.

Everyone got the Arrested Development, Encino Man and Austin Powers references right?

Charlotte and Daniel were pulling a Time Travelers Wife.

The scene with Locke and Christian Shephard totally made this episode for me, but up until that point I agree with whoever it was on the other thread that the episode seemed choppy. They did not do a good job integrating the various stories.

And we know Charlotte is truly dead because they played the music. Not for long, but they did play it.

Holli

PalmerEldritch said...

ANNYONG!

Stephanie said...

Morgan caught the "Annyong!"

memphish said...

So LOST will end with Ji Yeon wreaking revenge on those who destroyed her happy home.

Holli

PalmerEldritch said...

i'm glad that Ji-Yeon (sp?) isnt still a one year old

PalmerEldritch said...

baby charlie is adam and ji yeon is eve.

/not really

Trevor McFur said...

Desmond's boat must flyyyy. Not sure if I've figured out why exactly he needs to seek out Ms. Hawking, other than the fact the Daniel told him too. Dez didn't seem to be on Locke or Ben's radar at all.

I'll be disappointed if Walt isn't among the returnees. We know that Jeremy Bentham visited Walt, so pretty clearly he's supposed to go back (or at least was planned to when they wrote last season's finale).

I really wish that I hadn't read the opening credits, seeing Christian pop up would have been cooler if I hadn't been waiting for him. If he's an aspect of Jacob, he still thinks of Jack as his son.

Oh, hey, blogspot, how are you?

PalmerEldritch said...

welcome back, mister mcfur!

desmond could have taken a plane. or his storyline could have been weeks earlier than the rest of the 06s' stories. to give him some travel time and all.

i want Ji Yeon and Taller Ghost Walt to be among the Returnees. or the supposed-to-returnees.

t-dot kim said...

Trev!

clementinesdaddy said...

I don't feel bad for Monton. You learn as a child when you play with a smoke monster, it's all fun and games until someone loses an arm...

clementinesdaddy said...

Does anyone else think that it was Smokie talking to the French group from down the Cerebus vent? I think Monton wouldn't be too with it after losing his arm? Whaddya think? Smokies speaks!

Also Danielle's hubby said that Smokie is a security system for the temple. Is this the same temple Ben sent the Others to at the end of season 3? What goes on there? Who is in charge IN the temple?

PalmerEldritch said...

good catches, ClementinesDaddy. a few of 'em. Smokey being the voice of Montand would be pretty cool.

i also like the idea of Smokey grabbing people down the CVs and "inhabiting" them. maybe it wouldnt kill Rousseau cuz of the baby? and "took over" her husband and her friends to try to make sure that she was safe until Alex was born? once they were all gone but Rousseau and then Alex was born, did Smokey send Ben to Alex to keep her safe from Danielle "BatshiatInsane" Rousseau?

now, i've got to ponder all that for seven hours instead of sleeping.

clementinesdaddy said...

Yes! Maybe direct, physical contact with Smokey cause you to "join" the defense force of the island. Who else has physically touched Smokey?...Mr. John Locke.

Did Charlotte confirm what many people have been thinking about her possible parents? "My dad sent my mum and me away from the island and we never same him again." (paraphrased) Are Annie and Ben Charlotte's parents? Does Ben even know? Or did some other male on the island send his wife and daughter off the island? Did a whole mess of women and children emigrate from the island becuase of some danger that was threatening the Hostiles? (ie- Dharma)

Holder said...

By the end of the scene with Montand in the CV, I figured it HAD to be Smoky talking thru/as him. Way too calm.

The reveal with Eloise at the end was just terrible. It seriously angered me. I mean...they have dumbed this show down so so so much. We all already KNEW the deal...when they took SO LONG to show her face, I was hoping they were gonna pull the okie doke and show us someone who would blow our minds.

Christian Shephard and Locke were the only things that made this episode decent.

p.s. i hate the tar heels

Ralph- said...

FUCKING WOW!

Jordan from the 206 said...

Trevor. About Walt. I'm thinking he isn't in the storyline due to Lost losing Malcolm David Kelly to the Tyson Chicken commericals.

So with Charlotte (who died. awww. not really) telling Faraday that people are not supposed to return to the island, uh, what does this mean about Jacob/Christian/Ben trying to get them to come back? Or is Charlotte just confused? Did Faraday go back in time and tell Charlotte this because he finds something out? Which btw, great going. A lot of good telling Charlotte this info did. Seeing as how she didn't remember it until after going totally against the advice.

As for the nose bleeds. At first I just thought they had to do with the length of time spent on the island. Thats the reason it went from Charlotte to Miles to Juliet. But with what Charlotte was saying, she made it sound like it had to do with coming back to the island. Juliet was never on the island previousy, at least for all we know. And now Sawyer even has a nose bleed. So wtf? I still think it has more to do with length of time on the island than it does being on the island before. And what about Faraday? Hasn't be been on the island multiple times? Or wait, has that not happened yet? SIGH. Stupid time travel. SIGH.

Way to go writers. Heckuva big shocker when Desmond showed up. "You mean, you are here to find Faraday's mother as well?" WHAT?!!!! NO WAY!!! And how about that crazy, "WTF" giant reveal music when they showed Mrs Hawking. DUN DUN DUN! Gotcha! Yeah, not quite.

I did like how they worked around Locke's promise to Jin. At first I was like, "Ugh. He's going to have to lie to Jin. That's lame". But the way Ben and possibly Locke worked around it was good.

And I liked that Kate and Sayid took off. And that they are supposedly going without them. It would've been so convenient for everybody to suddenly buy into this crazy plan just like that. Although for all we know, next week Ben might have Hurley, Sayid, and Kate all kidnapped and sent with them.

Christian Shepherd sure seems to be acting like Jacob. At least in some shape or form.

I'm glad I wasn't the only one who thought that the guy who's arm was ripped off didn't seem too torn up about it (pun intended).

And sorry if this is a dumb question. But I'm not as good with all the little details over time as most of y'all. Who the hell is Montand, and why does everybody remember him and his armless self? I noticed everybody was waiting to see him lose his arm when the Frenchies showed up last week. Was he with Danielle early on in the series? Or did she refer to him? I don't recall anything.

Jordan from the 206 said...

Oh, I guess I really didn't give my overall thoughts to the ep. I liked it. Nothing amazing. But it was definitely interesting from start to finish.

JoeSC said...

Ralph, I think you and I were the only two who liked this episode... I thought it was thoroughly compelling. So many gaps were filled in, and yes, even though they telegraphed a couple of reveals, I think this was easily the best episode of Season 5... Only Jughead comes close.

Herlihy said...

I liked it... it was good but not amazing. there were parts that were fantastic and then parts that were weak.

Seeing Smokey again was well ace, we need more scenes with that creepy thing. It was the total highlight of the episode.

I also liked Charlotte in this episode. She was sweet and scared and not as bitchy as normal. Also, i couldn't help but think that after she died, everyone would know anyway because of the Life And Death refrain. Bit like the lack of a ticking clock on 24 really.

The writers have got to book up their ideas and make some good cliffhangers. Every single one this season so far have been awful and not as "WTF" as previous seasons, more like "oh... is that it?". Gutted.

Mr. Bill said...

Good one!

I'm wondering if Locke is just being manipulated again.

Brennan said...

Jordan, in season one when Danielle is leading Jack, Kate, Locke, Hurley, and Artz to the Black Rock, she mentions Montand. She says "This is where Montand lost his arm."

Also, one of the Frenchies was named Brennan. Cool for me, but I was hoping to see a cool death scene.

I liked the episode, but was not surprised at all by the reveal of Miss Hawkins at the end.

Brennan said...

So if Locke moved the island instead of Ben, would the island still be skipping through time?

I was almost expecting Montand to say something like "They all float down here." Speaking of IT, didn't Pennywise the Clown rip a kids arm off trying to pull him into the sewer?

memphish said...

Good call on IT Brennan. Too bad Smokey didn't look like a balloon.

Hey Mr. McFur! Good to see you.

Holli

Chris JC said...

Well...

(geddit?)

Perfectly good episode of LOST - best so far this year, and very LOSTian in a way that the others have not been.

I don't mind that the ending lacked wow - at least they didn't feel the need to go

DESMOND: You! It's you! The lady from the ring shop!

HAWKING: Ah, good to see you, Desmond. I told you the universe has a way of course correcting!

LOST THUD: Thud

The idea of Smokey pulling a fast one when Montand appeared to say m'aidez is the most likely.

Daniel now probably never leaves the island but is still able to travel through time - he goes to the Donkey Well and sees young Charlotte. I don't think his advice means that EVERYONE who returns to the island will die of nosebleed, just that SHE will - cos she did.

I remember someone calling last season that Locke was meant to move the island. Good shout.

Are we to assume that the time jumps have stopped now? And if so, are our Time Fuckers in the right year? And furthermore does that mean we won't see any more of Danielle's story? Apart from the method of arm-loss and the fact Jin was there I don't think we learned anything we didn't already know.

There's clearly still going to be time travel - I know the chronology of Faraday in the season opener has been debated but it looks like we've just set up that old Daniel can appear to young Charlotte. Also, to me, some of the non sequiturs she was coming out with, like her last words, are a link between the full body time travel and consciousness travel of the series. Like if it gets really bad, you start blasting your mind through time.

Maybe she SHOULD have had a constant after all - but since she appears to have known old Faraday as a young child and youngish Faraday as a grown woman then it would appear that it wouldn't really help in the end.

Despite the show's efforts, putting subtitles at the bottom of the screen near the beginning, I managed to avoid the name which would have revealed who was waiting for Locke at the bottom of that well.

Jin's English is getting surprisingly good, non?

See - you can tell I liked it. I haven't written anywhere near that much about any of the other episodes this year.

Oh, and I was a Charlotte fan. So bite me.

Stephanie said...

Trev, so good to see you back. We've missed you. Try holding your hand over the bottom of the screen during the opening credits to avoid being spoiled on the quest stars. This isn't ideal for me since I also miss who wrote the episode. But it's worth it to be surprised to see Christian.

Brennan, I'm always impressed when fans can recall details from season one. I've been wondering about Montand's story ever since Lindeluse talked about being inspired by Wages of Fear. I've been meaning to stick that one in my queue.

Stephanie said...

I have a plan for an animated .gif. I'm looking for an image of someone getting beat over the head. Cause that is what Lost has become for me. Or how about this?

PalmerEldritch said...

yeesh.

are people really that pissed off about the Eloise reveal?

i spent the "dramatic pause" waiting for Desmond to recognize her. which was sort of fun.

so what if we've already figured something out?

were we supposed to not have already figured it out? perhaps the fun part was supposed to be to wait for the characters to figure it out.

also, i'm betting that some people out there (prolly not podcast listeners) still haven't made the connection.

i dont think this was the best episode of season 5 or anything but it was a good, fun episode.

jin fluctuates between mangled english and no english. fun times. and for a guy that's only been learning english for 109 days or so, he understands a huge vocabulary of words. go jin! i guess that the "total immersion" theory really works.

Chris JC said...

Locke flashes away before Christian can tell him his son's name, but it's so obvious that it's going to be Jack. I'm calling it now - just you wait.

Stephanie said...

Ya think, Chris?
Yes, p. I was pissed. I said out loud that if we get a thud after seeing Eloise Hawking I will be mad.

PalmerEldritch said...

"YOU!!! You're Daniel Faraday's mother? It all makes perfect sense. The ring shop. The rat..."

"I'm not Mrs. Faraday. She's across the street."

"Oh. Nevermind then, brother."

/sneak peek at next week's episode

t-dot kim said...

I thought this episode was my favourite so far of the season. I really liked it.

Palmer, I also wasn't pissed of the Mrs. Hawking reveal. Like you said, the non-podcast listening viewers (aka, non-awesome viewers) were probably shocked that it was her.

I'm STILL not a Charlotte fan. Usually when I don't care of a LOST character, the episodes leading up to when he/she dies I somewhat change my feelings about the character. With Charlotte...nope. It really doesn't matter b/c she'll still be on the show--just not alive.

One of my favourite moments was the reunion of Jin and Sawyer. Aww.

What's with the flashes getting closer and closer together? With John turning the Donkey Wheel thingy, does that mean the flashes with stop?

t-dot kim said...

And.....

some bad news, and even badder news. The other half of TLI spent most of Wednesday in the hospital. I spoke with her this morning, she was in a car accident, but not hurt.

That's not even the bad news...

She's hasn't even watched LOST yet!!! (OK, not funny, but thought it would lighten the mood)

:P She's going to watch LOST when she gets home...she'll be told not to go into work until Tuesday.

Therefore, no live show tonight on ustream.tv We're going to re-schedule, or I may just do a show by myself. I'll keep you guys posted.

Also Aimee wanted me to tell everyone that's she's changed her myspace page: (lol, I know...)
www.myspace.com/aimeenoto for all those who want to change it

Chris JC said...

Get well soon, Aimee Noto.

I only know of one other Noto, Clair Noto

And tonight was the night that watching on UStream was a possibility for me.

Which, of course, is not the important thing. Send Aimee our regards pls, Kim!

memphish said...

Get well Aimee! And watch LOST. I like LOST.

Be forewarned that very disturbing pictures of that psycho woman who has 14 children pregnant with the 8 are all over the interwebs. Talk about your birth control.

Holli

t-dot kim said...

I don't know how anyone wants to give birth to one child...forget about 14!

/disgusted
//baby hater
///deal with it!

Stephanie said...

Tell Aimee we're glad to hear she's ok.
Being pregnant and having a baby isn't so bad. It's the two years following it that will drive you nuts.

/mother of a once, high-maintenance, colicy, strong-willed child

PalmerEldritch said...

get better, oklahaimee!!

KABLAMO!!!

PalmerEldritch said...

oh. and what type of pics of that lady who had 14 kids? ...?

cuz that'd be 14 kids who'd find those pics of their mom on the internet in 15 or so years and be scarred for life. ack.

Chris JC said...

LOST: Nice to see Sawyer's continued journey into unambiguous good guy and hero.

Herlihy said...

the non-podcast listening viewers (aka, non-awesome viewers)

LOL!

also, my regards Aimee of Little Rock. Hope you get better soon. Let the record show that you are my favourite blonde TLI lady.

Jordan from the 206 said...

Palmer, Right on about Jin's English. Sometimes he doesn't understand a word people are saying (like when the Frenchies had to draw a radio tower in the sand. or when he needed Charlotte to translate). Then other times he pretty much understands everything said to him. And his own English fluctuates just as much. There are times when he can barely put together a string of words that make sense. Then there are other times when he is using fancier words than who he is talking to. Just masked in his accent and with pauses. Seems as if they are having a hard time pinning down just exactly how good he's become with the language.

Kim, I think the reason you didn't feel for Charlotte in her death episode was because we didn't get the customary death episode flashback. That's usually what gets you to feel for even the more disliked characters on the show (ie Shannon).

I wasn't that upset at the Mrs Hawking reveal. I mean, how else were they supposed to do it? I was just a bit disappointed in the obviousness in the set up. Had they wanted to, they could've been a lot more vague leading up. But I think we've all agreed that it seems that the writers have made a deal with ABC to cater to the non-podcast fans. Oh well.

Speaking of explaining things with a rock to the head. Has anybody watched the post-ep explanations? I usually stop my dvr the second I see "LOST", because I don't want to see the preview for next week. But a friend showed me the piece from last week. It was terrible. It's a guy using action figures (ripping off the youtube guys btw) giving the most heavy handed "THIS IS WHAT JUST HAPPENED!" recap you have ever seen. Ugh. Worse even than the dumbhanced pop-up video. And really annoying in that last weeks recap actually didn't stop where the ep stopped. It continued with Sun pulling the gun on Ben. What the hell is up with that? Totally spoiled that. But I guess it was also in the preview. See, that's why I don't watch that stuff.

PalmerEldritch said...

"Has anybody watched the post-ep explanations?"

wait... what?

the LOST Untangled crap?

never seen it. now i want to so i can be enraged!

PalmerEldritch said...

WTF??!!!

ENRAGED!!!!!

PalmerEldritch said...

Watch Ben Kneejerk

is he wearing a Renaissance shirt?

andrew. said...

- crazy Pittsburgh winds knocked my power out. I can't post this until my modem comes back on-line. I'm time-stamping this 12:25 AM EST. Nobody steal my theories!! (j/k sorry for any repeated observations) Thank heavens that the power kicked off after LOST, hopefully it will be back on before next week's episode.

- i actually liked this episode more than the "Little Prince," but i also enjoy being contrary.

- i'm pretty pro at not paying attention to the opening credits, but sure enough, i managed to not see any credits except John Terry and Fionnula Flanagan. Gee, i wonder who Locke is going to see at the Orchid. OMG who could that be lighting those candles? (although that was a weird reveal since Ben just said they were going to see Eloise Hawking (or did we never actually learn her whole name on the show proper? (superfluous parenthetical)))

- to be clear, i don't really believe my theory about Locke going back to Humboldt County. I was just trying humor Ralph's desperate attempt to make "Further Instructions" relevant. Although, Locke really should end in some other time and place.

- so Mrs. Hawking doesn't seem terribly concerned about whether all of the Losties are there at once. It seemed like she was perfectly happy to send them back piecemeal. It also seemed like Ben was volunteering Desmond to go back to the island. That guy's not going to like that.

- So Christian Shepherd seemed to suggest that Locke pushing the donkey wheel would have had a different outcome, but then he also seemed to want Locke to bring everyone back to the island. Why does it seem like Ben manipulated Locke so that Ben could be the one to turn the wheel and then bring all of the losties back to the island, like it's all a big contest and you get to be king-shit of the island if you win? arggh.

- whent the french red shirt lady went missing, i kept waiting for Jin to say "others, Others!" since it was one of his first english phrases, but it would have been a weird bit of time-fuckery since Rousseau was the first to talk about "the others" and introduce the concept to the Oceanic Losties. It was a relief when Jin said "monster"

- yeah, Charlotte was definitely dead. Giacchino's score said so. Good thing she distilled her entire backstory with her dying breaths. Do you think creepy Daniel fell in love with her back in the Dharma days or after Abaddon gathered the spook force? Daniel seemed taken aback by the news that he'd met her in the past, so i'm pretty sure he hasn't been to the Orchid yet. BUT if it's already in the cards that Charlotte dies BEFORE Daniel goes back in time what does he hope to gain by warning her not to come back to the island AND what will really bake your noodle, even if he recognizes the futility in warning her, since she already experienced it in her past that means that he has to carry out the warning regardlessly.

- Did Sun steal President Roslyn's wig?

- Interesting tie-back with Robert dry-firing the rifle at Rousseau, since Rousseau said something to the effect of "Robert didn't check either" when Sayid first met her and tried to shoot her.

- Based on Robert's actions, it definitely seemed like the French folk were actually mind-controlled. I had the same thought about Smokie impersonating the Frenchies when they went into the temple's crack-hole. oh god, remember all of the confusing nonsense about whether Yemi was the smoke monster, compounded by Damon & Carlton implying that sometimes the visions were the smoke monster and sometimes they weren't?

- Jin should leave the island and come back so that Daniel Dae Kim can just speak English. It's getting a little uncomfortable listening to him fake the broken english.


- Desmond coming up out of the tree line saying "Hey guys! You here for the party too?" was funny.

- funny (but seriously gross!) echo with Locke breaking his shin since Ben also took a spill, and injured his arm, before he pushed the Donkey Wheel

- Things i liked:
* Rope sticking out of the ground gag
* the jammed-up donkey wheel
* Kate actually doing the smart thing and grabbing Aaron up while Sun had her crazy time.
* Ben responding to Jack's ridiculously lame threat to kill him (again) by pulling the van over and saying "WTF dude. I could be partying it up with all of my dollars and fake passports but instead i'm chauffering you jerks around through these surprisingly empty LA streets trying to save existence. So, either put up or shut up!"
* Josh Holloway's acting when Sawyer came across Jin. It was a good reaction shot.
* Ji Yeon on the phone with Sun. awwwwww. plus we can rest easy that the kid is alive, not kidnapped, grown beyond infancy, and Sun is actually kind of fond of her.

andrew. said...

- Best wishes to Aimee In Hospital Bed. Glad she's okay. The car accident didn't happen to involve a Pontiac Bonneville did it? LOST

JoeSC said...

Get well soon Aimee! We can't go too long without our TLI fix!!!

Out of all of the really cool moments in this episode, I have to say that my favorite was Ben slamming on the brakes in the van and totally losing his shit on Jack and Sun. It really goes to show that no matter how cool and collected you are, everyone has a breaking point!

Those couple of lines in the van have made we want to root harder for Ben than I ever have on this show. Even though we don't know exactly what his true motives are, you could just feel how absolutely passionate he was about getting this done and how totally offended he was by the fact that no one is giving him credit for the fact that they're still alive.

After the first four episodes I was a little worried about the direction of the show, but this was one of those kick you in the nuts episodes that makes you remember why this is the best show on TV!

Just like "Flashes Before Your Eyes" made up for the poor start to Season 3, this episode has completely rejuvenated me as a LOST fan!

JoeSC said...

Oh, and on a side note, what was with the gore? Not that I have anything wrong with it, but the special effects team must have had a field day with Montan's arm being ripped off, Locke's calf protrusion and just the sheer volume of blood that was spilled this episode. I'm really digging the whole "we're not holding anything back anymore" vibe of this episode!

Chris JC said...
This comment has been removed by the author.
JoeSC said...

Oh yeah, one more point while I'm at it. I still can't believe it took more than 3 seasons for Ben and Desmond to have a scene together... My two favorite characters are finally together and I couldn't be more excited to see if their scenes will start to rival those of Locke and Ben!

andrew. said...

- good find Chris. I'll have to keep checking back to make sure i'm properly updated on the latest in lostigation.
WARNING though: there are actual spoilers in some of the other posts and it is likely that he will continue to post spoilery photographs in the future.

Chris JC said...

Yeah, I've since seen that - very funny but one to be avoided by the spoiler-free, just in case.

PalmerEldritch said...

yaaaaaaaargh!!!!

/saw spoily pics

Chris JC said...

Oh no - I'm sorry!

Although, without asking which ones, note that the fella isn't above photoshopping for a cheap laugh, like his picture of Sawyer as a pirate.

Chris JC said...

Right - just in case, I've taken the earlier message out of the thread. For people who don't mind the fact that they might be spoiled if they investigate too much, and might enjoy some LOST laughs, the link again (with all the above warnings in place) is

http://themisfitishere.blogspot.com

The gist of my first message was wondering how I had managed to never hear of this chap before.

Jimmy said...

I was fine with the end reveal. As Palmer mentioned, how else could they have really done it. I thought the French Team appearance last week and the endless "Don't show their faces for ages" or the "Slightly change their voice, then make their voice slowly come right" reveals make me squirm.

I know I bitched about it on my last segment...but it's a question of degree, I think.

I seriously thought we would learn a lot more about the Monster tonight, and in fact we got nothing we didn't already know. It's likely that Jin pleading with Rousseau to stay above ground was what stopped her going nuts wit the rest of them!

For all this, I'm going to have to look at the episode again as I didn't really feel blown away by it the way others are.

Trevor McFur said...

I didn't think last night was anything special. The MTV edits with the time jumps drove me crazy. Plus, using time travel to hop around and show you the Island's Greatest Hits is starting to bother me a bit.

I didn't mind the Mrs. Hawking reveal, or think that they introduced it as an 'OMG!' moment. I think that, if you never watched the show before, and only saw the season opener, you probably could have figured out that the old lady at the end was also the old lady that Daniel told Desmond to find. The funny thing is, 'Flashes' was, what, 2 years ago, and Mrs. Hawking was in it for all of 2 minutes? So the whole non-podcast listening, internet surfing Lost crowd probably still doesn't know that she's also the ring lady.

Nosebleeds are due to the amount of exposure to the island, not to whether you've been there and came back. Daniel isn't bleeding yet because he's only been to the island for a few weeks. The time traveling doesn't count because it's still in his future. And he tells Charlotte to not go back because he still loves her and wants to save her, even though he knows that it won't work.

I wonder in Daniel goes back in time and gets stuck there with the DI.

mb said...

Alright - I'm probably the last of the frikkin-huge posts but here goes...

Well, I like the episode better now having read everyone's comments. It did feel to me like one of those episodes that's all connective tissue (which is not necessarily all bad). The three elements that piqued my interest while watching were Smokey's temple, the possession/sickness of Frenchies, and Christian @the donkey wheel. But reading everything here makes me want to talk about a bunch of stuff (yep - here comes a long post).

I seem to be one of the few who is able to completely ignore the credits at the beginning of the show. As soon as Lost is on screen for me - nothing else matters (I use a mild sedative on the kids for Wed. nite bedtime)

I'm assuming/hoping that we're getting more Danielle backstory. While I've enjoyed the short bit we've gotten, it's not near what I've been expecting.
RE: Montand/Robert/rest of the team = Smokey? Definitely possible - Robert was either batshit, possessed, or that wasn't him. I'm going with 'it wasn't him' b/c I think Montand's voice was something else as well (no WAY he'd be calling back up to them - I'd think he'd be unconscious at LEAST). Perhaps the 'evil' incarnations of her team were akin to whatever Eko saw that looked like Yemi. Could be that Smokey was 'inhabiting' them, as Palmer said, or they were visions and not re-animated bodies. Either way - something on the island is using dead people (or their likenesses) to fuck with people like Danielle and Eko.

"Interesting tie-back with Robert dry-firing the rifle at Rousseau, since Rousseau said something to the effect of "Robert didn't check either" when Sayid first met her and tried to shoot her."

NICE catch Andrew. Love it.

The Hawking reveal at the end didn't bother me. I'm a little surprised at how much it bothered others - like Palmer, I thought the jist of that scene was to see the reactions of the Jack, Dez and Sun - mainly Dez.

I think that I'm now routing for Ben too (like Ben from the Dharmalars - see his kneejerk reaction). Not sure how long the sentiment will last, but it does seem, between the apparent worry he displayed to Hawking when he didn't think he could get the 06 together, and LOSING IT in the car with Jack and Sun, he seems like he's genuinely trying to save the island and the people on it. HOWEVER - there is also the issue, which I find really compelling, that HE was not supposed to turn the donkey wheel - so did he know that and did it anyway, which begs the question 'what's his motivation for getting transported off the island and helping bring back the O6?' To gain favor with Jacob or something? BUT - it should be noted that he seems to be gathering up the O6 only AFTER Locke/Bentham failed - like he's finishing the job.
From what we've seen of his post-island activities - his first mission after leaving seemed to be dealing with Widmore and his international network of allies/goons, THEN perhaps he became aware of Locke off-island, and after he died, decided to finish getting the O6 together.

I did LOVE Ben losing his cool though. Now that we are getting a glimpse of the bigger picture re: the island, and also wanting to see the O6 get back there, his rant in reaction to Jack and Sun seemed really appropriate. I think it was that more than anything that engendered my sympathy. It really makes me anxious for more of his story (motivations and such - which I imagine will come along with finding out the island backstory as well)

"What's with the flashes getting closer and closer together? With John turning the Donkey Wheel thingy, does that mean the flashes with stop?"

Kim - I assumed now that the donkey wheel is 'fixed' that the time-skipping will stop. But where/when?

I had to laugh - LOCKE says ""What are you doing here?"
CHRISTIAN: "I'm here to help you the rest of the way."

and then

LOCKE: "Can you help me up?"
CHRISTIAN: "No, sorry I can't"

I can't remember who asked why Daniel didn't function as Charlotte's constant - I thought it was b/c she hadn't remembered him (from childhood) until it was too late. I thought that in order for a constant to work - you had to consciously be aware that the person/thing was the same in both time periods.

Anyway - I did like several elements of the episode - I think I'm just anxious to get the O6 back to the island, so this episode felt like a bit of a delay in that storyline.

Mr. Bill said...

Get well soon Aimee!!!

Ditto MB!

Trevor McFur said...

mb, I thought that the most interesting thing about Christian was the smackdown he gave Locke for listening to Ben. Made me wonder again what the relationship between Ben and Jacob is at this point.

It kind of surprises me how fast the storyline is moving, especially the off-island story. It's like, all the stuff they set up last season -- Sun maybe turning evil and working for Charles, Sayid working with Ben and killing off Widmore's henchmen, Hurley being completely off his rocker, Dez and Penny in hiding -- looks like it's going to tied up within the first 1/4 of the new season. Maybe I'm still used to the show moving so gradually that it's throwing me off.

Jordan from the 206 said...
This comment has been removed by the author.
mb said...

OMG - what an a-hole I am! Totally forgot to say GET BETTER AIMEE! Car crashes suck donkey wheel balls - sorry you were in one.

"It kind of surprises me how fast the storyline is moving"

Yeah I agree Trev. After last night, I'm almost wondering why they've limited themselves to 27 more eps (is that right?). Seems like some of this stuff could use a LITTLE more time to breathe. But then I suppose I'd be complaining about not finding things out - lol
As I always tell myself with this show - wait and see...

you can't win with rabid fans I tell you.

Jordan from the 206 said...

Join the Scott and Steve blogspotter map!

Been meaning to make something like this for a while. Figure it would be neat to see where everybody is interwebbing from. Very simple to sign up. No confirmation email, so feel free to use a fake one.

Mr. Bill said...

Joaquin on Letterman reminds me of Crispin Wierdness!

Mr. Bill said...

Kablamo!

mb said...

Thanks for setting up that Platial map. good stuff!

I'm getting a "404 not found" message with the Joaquin link - is it just me?

I've seen that Crispin Glover clip before, and it's like a car crash that you can't avert your eyes from. Too funny.

Mr. Bill said...

Try this one

Jordan from the 206 said...

I think the entire Joaquin Phoenix thing is a big elaborate hoax by him and Casey Affleck, who is filming a supposed documentary about Phoenix's quitting hollywood for a rap career. Probably more like a big, "gotcha!" mockumentary. But like some of the big ah-ha's on Lost of late. I don't think people are gonna be exactly surprised.

mb said...

I like your thinking Jordan. Cause he was fine a couple of years ago on Letterman

But who knows, maybe he's just "creating a new personna" for his new career. Maybe both ideas are true.

t-dot kim said...

Hey my peeps...I just put a msg up at the ustream.tv page. If anyone happens to go looking for us, let them know there isn't going to be a show tonight

Aimee isn't well enough to record. I'll be away from the computer as I'm attempting to create the bacon weave log thingy :P I'll post pictures.

Hummm...maybe I'll just have a ustream video of me trying to cook all night. Naaaaahhhh

Chris JC said...

I could put up a stream of me sitting here at 1am having just finished work and being too screen wired to actually sleep yet.

PalmerEldritch said...

kim!!! are you making a bacon explosion?! :-o


/single tear

mb said...

SWEEEET Kim! You are the bomb. I await the review (I'm assuming you'll try a bite)

PalmerEldritch said...

just... be careful, kim. ok?

with great bacon comes great responsibility.



and a video podcast of you cooking and trying the Bacon Explosion would be AWESOME.

Jimmy said...

I was thinking last night that maybe Charles Whidmore was banished from the Island in the 50's for killing his mate by breaking his neck. The others put him on trial, and a young "sherrif" provides over the trail. He gets branded with that symbol (as Ben mentioned, like the Cadbury Egg symbol) and we will see that at a later date.

PalmerEldritch said...

woah.


that would definitely work, jimmy.

i have heard that the Others have a strict 3 Strikes policy when it comes to snapping your friends' necks.

t-dot kim said...

I've been taking pictures as I go along...it's much more difficult than I first imagined.

Mr. Bill said...

You could be right Jordan. Joaquin Phoenix could be doing an Andy Kaufman/Tony Clifton style thing.

I've heard people calling that kind of thing comic genius but I think it is just stupid.

Poor David Letterman gets all the nuts trying to reinvent themselves in a ridiculous way.

What about Garth Brooks as Chris Gaines

What a Tard!

aimee in little rock said...

Thank you to everyone for your well wishes. I'm okay, just stuck with some bad neck injury from the whiplash. The 77-year old woman in her Lincoln Towncar smashed into me before speeding into the side of an office building, thenwalked out without a scratch. I've got bruises & a doofy neckbrace, but at least I don't look like Charlotte. Dead or alive. I'm high as fuck right now. And I like lost.

Yours Truly high,

Oklahaimee
aimeenoto@aol.com

Chris JC said...

Did they morphine you up, Aimee?

Mr. Bill said...

Glad you are mostly alright Aimee!

Smile

JoeSC said...

Great to hear you're alright Aimee! I'm sure you would have loved the new episode without drugs... Watching doped up might cause your head to explode (or at least your nose bleed)!

Also, just had a chance to listen to last week's podcast today. I appreciate the offer (or was it a prize?) of the 2 minute make-out session with Kim, but I have no intention of heading up to Canadialand any time soon, so... her loss (sorry Kim)! :-)

BTW... I like Lost too.

Oh, and Jimmy, AWESOME theory on Widmore getting kicked off the island. Never even though about that. Does that Sherrif make an encore appearance this season? Hmmmm.... I guess they had to find some way to make her interesting considering her only appearance was in the second worst episode of all time (how's that for a resume builder?).

t-dot kim said...
This comment has been removed by the author.
t-dot kim said...

Whoops...

or Palmer, for you

Holder said...

Does Jessie who calls The Transmission sound a lot like Ralph/Ben to anyone?

andrew. said...

-I'm high as fuck right now. And I like lost. this should be the new TLI T-shirt.

- i'm starting to lose my trust in the show. Listening to the new Official LOST podcast, D&C basically said that they really hadn't been interested in exploring Rousseau's back story at all, which of course contradicted about 3 years worth of Comicon Q&A's. Plus they made some flippant remark about Libby being a non-mystery like Kate's plane. I'm sorry but they're the ones that made the big deal about Libby being in Santa Rosa. I guess I can see how all of her story could just be coincidences, but it's frustrating that they're starting to pick and choose which mysteries are important. I really didn't care who was in the coffin at the end of last season. I'd completely forgotten about it, but they brought it up and hammered it in the promos. They could have just as easily dismissed that as "oh yeah, it was just somebody Jack and Kate knew, and Jack was all hopped up on goofballs so he wasn't acting rationally." Instead they're treating Libby as "some kooky chick who spent some time in a mental institution, and on a whim gave somebody she just met in a coffee shop a really expensive boat. The universe is full of crazy chance encounters."

Chris JC said...

FUCKING HELL!

Chris JC said...

Which, I thought, would appear after Kim's Bacon Pics - bloody Gmail forwarding stopping at 61 posts...

Chris JC said...

I do think, though, that if you're Damon and Carlton you must get sick of fan's asking when we'll see, for example, Hurley's balcony incident - as if the whole show is utterly incomplete without it (whereas the most you need to know is that it happened).

Libby is in a different league, admittedly, but - whether they want to admit it or not - here is another occasion (like with Eko) where the actor fucked them up and had to leave the show. I realise a couple of the people in question have been back as magic dead folks (even ore if you count INVISIBLE magic dead folks), but they probably wouldn't want to have them in for long enough to do the rest of the plot anyway.

Frankly with some of the high profile cast problems I'm amazed they've managed to keep it going this well.

Chris JC said...

"fan's"

uh-oh.

PalmerEldritch said...

After preparing a version of the dish, Andrew Vennari of the San Francisco Food Examiner said the dish tasted better than expected, "but I didn't learn the true meaning of the bacon explosion until the next day."

uh-oh.

Stephanie said...

Naw, I would recognize ralph- or Ben's voices anywhere.

Aimee, I'm so sorry you're in a neck brace. I remember being in one a few years ago when a dump truck pulled out in front of me while I was going 70 mph. If you're claustrophobic at all, it can be hell.

Most ridiculous part of This Place is Death-
Jin not recognizing Sawyer's voice. WTF?

Chris JC said...

And Sawyer not recognising Jin's hair.

In all seriousness - with the language barrier and all, many of the voices may sound alike to him. Reasonable?

andrew. said...

yeah, i get the sense that D&C are pretty frustrated with their audience asking questions about things that they thought were settled or non-starters. The thing is that i'm not even that concerned about any Libby mysteries, it was just Carlton's really uncalled for mocking tone of voice. Plus there are ways of writing around casting problems. Hurley could have met someone at Santa Rosa who knew Libby's story, maybe a better use of their time than seeing Ma & Pa Reyes bumbling around.

Chris JC said...

I've just had a listen and I think they may have rubbed you up the wrong way - you can never quite be sure when these guys are being tongue in cheek.

andrew. said...

maybe you're right. i'm going to take a nap.

Stephanie said...

Holy Shit! Romo Lampkin on Burn Notice!

I feel sure the Joaquin deal is a fake. Celebrities probably have it in writing what will be discussed on talk shows.

While researching how to spell Montand's name (which I'm not confident that this is correct) I discovered Mira Furlan was asked to be written out of the show. I've often wondered if the story suffers because they can't get an actor back.

PalmerEldritch said...

where'd you read that?

PalmerEldritch said...

and yes, "the internet" would be too vague an answer. :p

Chris JC said...

Montand is correct,

I'm wondering how many podcasts are going to pronounce "Robert" the Anglicised way rather than the French way? I've heard one already.

Chris JC said...

Mira Furlan

Chris JC said...

Kaaaaaaaaaaa...

PalmerEldritch said...

BLAAAAAAAMO!

Chris JC said...

NICE!

hat was worth waiting up for. Bedtime = 03:26.

Stephanie said...

I get the feeling all the actors may have "Island Fever". Maybe even Damon and Carlton are getting Lost Weary.

PalmerEldritch said...

"I'm okay, just stuck with some bad neck injury from the whiplash."

damn. not sure i'd classify that as "okay." get better! at least you have plenty of time to rewatch your LOST dvds. right?

anyhow, Aimee, glad nothing like this happened to you. mainly becaues you'd have to be a complete freak in the first place. creepy old lady!!!

Stephanie said...

When is Lost's off week?

Chris JC said...

The claim was that there wouldn't be one on Feb 18th (happy birthday, guys) which would be this week's. Have we heard anything about it not being on this week?

Let's check the ol' video podcast - they usually say at the end.

It might be confusion based on episodes 6 and 7 having been swapped around, so that the one which might have been expected on the 18th is actually to be shown on the 25th. Sound reasonable?

I know the big plan was to have no breaks at all.

Chris JC said...

Video podcast does indeed confirm an episode for this week: Wednesday February 18th.

I'll be 32 by then!

PalmerEldritch said...

next week. no episode on the 18th.


pretty sure.

PalmerEldritch said...

hrmmm?!

Chris JC said...

I won't do titles as some folks consider them spoilers but the former episode 6 and 7 have swapped places.

The latest official (audio) podcast states that they have been written in such a way that they can be viewed in either order but this was the one they felt worked better.

so, if someone who knew ep 6's title looked it up and saw it was due on the 25th then it stands to reason that they might think that there was a week off.

I don't think there will be. this Wednesday will be LOST as usual.

Stephanie said...

Episode 6 will air on the 18th.
Episdoe 7 airs on the 25th.
It doesn't look like I'll be working any Wednesdays, Thursdays or Fridays for a while.

Stephanie said...

Speaking of Thursdays, I'm over the 30 Rock backlash I was feeling. Tina Fey is amazing. This Jon Hamm arc is outstanding. The Office, not so much.

PalmerEldritch said...

well, that's good news then. but who's gunna break the news to Ralph that he'll have LOST on the night of his birthday?

PalmerEldritch said...

this may be a bit much:

official dharma jumpsuit for only $90

Chris JC said...

Say "Happy Birthday Ralph (and Alirio)! They're putting on an episode of one of your favourite shows on your birthday - how cool is THAT!?"

andrew. said...

- sorry for being a disinformant. IMDB has updated that there will indeed be an episode Feb. 18th but now (grain of salt) are saying that there won't be an episode March 4th.

- Someone upped the ante on the Bacon Explosion - http://thisiswhyyourefat.com/

The Dharmalars said...

The show will be up late tonight.

sorry gang,

ralph-

Chris JC said...

It's cool, Andrew, you saw what you saw.

the problem with IMDB is it's all publicly updated - it's like Wikipedia, it just takes longer to sort things out on there.

PalmerEldritch said...

BOIGAH DAY!

wendy's.

get something healthy.

or maybe a baconator.

PalmerEldritch said...

you convinced me. baconator.

mb said...

Wait - so how many birthdays are coming up this week -
Ralph's....and Chris? did you say your b-day was this week?

PalmerEldritch said...

alirio's bday too?

Jordan from the 206 said...

Those who have yet to join the Scott and Steve map, what are you waiting for?

Jordan from the 206 said...

Steph, "30 Rock backlash"? What? Why were you ever thinking that? That show is and has been outstanding for some time now. I will agree with you on The Office. It's extremely hit and miss for me now. Still enjoy it. But 30 Rock makes it look like an unfunny bastard cousin.

And as for Andrew's comments about Darlton. I agree, they don't give you a ton of reason to put too much faith in them, when it comes to the "We planned this stuff all along" stuff. I actually think Damon in the newest audio podcast might of had a moment of confession hidden in the guise of sarcasm. He said something like, "All these people were asking about Rouseau, so we thought up time travel as a way to explain her story." Ok, I don't think that's 100% true. But you know what they say, "Truth is often hidden in jest". And I totally think that he was being somewhat truthful there. Time travel definitely was a device thought up to explain unexplainable things and to cover topics in the past like Rouseau and the statue, that fans have been demanding to know about. But as for not liking them getting annoyed at fan questions and sarcastically mocking them? You know what? That doesn't bother me. If I were in the same position, I too would probably mock obsessive fans who ask if the Hurley bird will ever be explained and if Vincent knows who Jacob is. lol. I love Lost. But some fans are a bit too crazy imo. There are a ton of demanded answers out there that to me shouldn't even be considered mysteries. Just because something vague happens that is odd, doesn't mean it has to be explained. It's neat that Lost fans are so detail obsessed. But sometimes it does go a bit too far. And I would mock it too if I were them.

Selecta said...

- i usually like D&C's sense of humor and the fact that they do mock questions about things like Kate's plane or the hurley bird or tease people when they ask questions like "what is the smoke monster?". I guess i just resented being on the other side when they lumped Libby in as a ridiculous thing to still be wondering about, and exactly because I think they had some plans for her storyline and dropped them unceremoniously because of problems with keeping Cynthia Watros.
One thing I really like about Ron D Moore's Battlestar Galactica commentaries is that he admits to mistakes, explains when the process of making a show doesn't gel with his artistic vision.
I like Damon & Carlton, think they're smart & funny and have done an admirable job of helming Lost, but sometimes their shit stinks just like everyone else.

Jordan from the 206 said...

Agree with you Selecta. Especially when you compare them to Ronald D. Moore. He does exactly what I fault Damon and Carlton for not doing. Admitting mistakes and admitting the true process of how things came to be. He doesn't act like he had a glorious gigantic vision plotted out from day one, when he knows he didn't.

andrew. said...

ha ha oops. Selecta was me. maybe i was subconsciously shamed from posting so much.

- is it rude to ask about the blogspot's Valentines plans? Mine involve getting a bite to eat and then working a bunch. Romance.

Jordan from the 206 said...

When is Valentines day?

I think that answers you question.

PalmerEldritch said...

bought the ladyfriend a CD and a bauble for her office. hopefully, we'll go see Coraline in 3D. maybe some sort of take out for lunch or dinner?

Chris JC said...

Been working a bunch up until 1am including RIGHT NOW.

Intend to spend tomorrow asleep.

PalmerEldritch said...

i think you mean "i intend to give my wife a day to herself so she can relax and unwind."

dont mention that you'll be asleep and drooling on the pillow all day.

Chris JC said...

I'm older than Ralph. I'm not sure what year Alirio was born, but I might be older than him, too.

Chris JC said...

And I WILL be drooling on the pillow.

How can that be prevented? Duct tape seems to be the most straightforward option.

mb said...

"Time travel definitely was a device thought up to explain unexplainable things and to cover topics in the past like Rouseau"

Jordan, do I need to revisit our debate again...

i keed

Seriously though, while I think that they ARE using the time travel aspect of the show to make it easier to explain her backstory (and truncate it I think), it seems to me, with Mira Furlan asking to be written out of the show (like Triple A), I'm guessing they had to scrap whatever plans they had for that character and tie it up more quickly.

I do agree with the frustration with Cuselof though. It seems like all that they are doing by explaining it this way (i.e. trying to come off as having planned this) is pissing off the harder-core fans - which are the people who listen to the OLP and would CARE what their reasoning is is the first place.

Jordan from the 206 said...

I agree about Furlan asking to be written out and it affecting Rouseau's story. But I still think the time travel concept as a whole was created in part to help be able to explain so much, so easily.

But back to Rouseau real quick. Damon and Carlton were acting like this past ep was enough explanation needed. And really, I don't see what we exactly learned. Just little insignificant things. Like how some random dude lost his arm and the fact that the people turned on each other. Really, just all stuff we already knew, just that we got to witness it happen. Not really any explanation. But I guess that fits in with their opinion that it isn't all that an intersting story to visit. Translation, they didn't have anything interesting to show.

Insekt said...

"Jordan, do I need to revisit our debate again..."

Please don't.

Chris JC said...

New thread, lads.