I can only imagine there aren't any comments because no one could pull themselves away from the TV.
What an incredibly well acted episode. I feel confident that the second half of this season is going to be mind-blowing and I feel a LOT better about the direction we're heading.
The wine bottle monologue was superb. I think Jacob and MiB's roles have been pretty clearly laid out and I can't wait to see how this plays out.
I didn't like it. There were a million commercials using up that extra 6 minutes apparently because there's just not that much to recap about V. The ultimate "answer" that Jacob will bring you to an Island to be brutalized by a Smoke Monster and die of thirst because he doesn't want to tell you right from wrong makes him as much a vindictive bastard as any MIB. The Island is Pandora's Box, but apparently without hope lurking in the the bottom of the MIB box. I don't care who wins. Maybe my only investment left is in the sideways world where the people who look like the characters I care about at least have some sort of chance to be something other than pawns.
Holli - I can totally see where you're coming from. I think this episode is going to be on the extremes for a lot of people. I thought it was an excellent episode, but the wife hated it. She doesn't care about Jacob or MiB, so this episode was particularly frustrating for her.
I liked the Richard story in terms of giving us his background, but I really don't like where it's left us in terms of the mythology. I feel like I don't have a side to pull for. Jacob is a dick who brings people to the Island to die to prove a point, a point he's always failed to prove. MIB is "evil," but it doesn't really feel like a threat to me. In the meantime it leaves me feeling like the people I actually care about are nothing but pawns and I don't want any of them to have to suffer the fate of being stuck on the Island forever trapping Locke/MIB.
Meh...I was expecting so much more because of all the hype. Not that I didn't like the episode, but I did get my hope's up and I guess I was expecting more from Richard's backstory than 40 minutes of his wife and getting out of the ship.
And seriously? The ship destroyed the statue? I rolled my eyes and laughed. That must have been a big wave!
Darlton said many times that this episode was filled with answers. Answers that the other writers couldn't believe they wanted to spill so early in the season. I must have missed them...
hence why i think it will have a Babylon 5 ending. methinks the LOSTies will tell Jacob and Flockington to go fuck themselves. they're both demented assholes.
as an aside, they're not in hell. that was just Smokey pulling on Rico Suave's strings. but now we'll get the eight billion phone calls to every podcast about how they're dead and in hell.
as for holli, i think it's good that you're looking at both of them as douche bags. it'd be too easy for it to be cut and dry. sure, Flocke is chaotic and possibly evil but he's seemingly willing to give you what you want as a reward for helping him. and Jacob's trying to protect the world from Smokey but, oops, he's a pompous asshole who doesnt care who dies along the way.
which is really similar to Babylon 5. uh oh. there must be some other twist along the way.
"Ok, so if the alt universe happens, we all go to hell?"
no. :p
i think Jacob was saying that if Smokey gets loose, SHIT GOES DOWN. it'd be a bad scene, as the kids are fond of saying. he'd wreak havoc.
and he was saying if Smokey got loose. not (necessarily) if the Alt Universe happens.
but, man, there's got to be a point to the alti-verse. btw, no alti-verse! w00t?
how'd you like the Ricardus music?
and back to steph, i dont know. maybe you're right. but i got the impression that every hell mentioned was a metaphor and or a manipulative lie that also happened to be a metaphor.
I knew there was a reason I didn't watch Babylon 5.
Yeah, at this point I guess we all need to be on Team Sawyer hijacking the sub. Hey, maybe that's what the alt-world is. Sawyer and everyone takes the sub on the wrong heading and comes out in X world where dead people who aren't on the sub are now on a plane. Okay it needs some work.
I don't understand why Flocke can't leave if Jacob's dead. I guess it has to do with candidates still being alive, but that's such another douchy Jacob cheat. I'll put a bunch of people on a cave wall/lighthouse wheel and unless someone other than you kills them then you're stuck. Neener, neener, neener.
It also feels like Jacob trapped MIB like trapping a genie in a bottle which also feels like not playing fair. Screw you Jacob. (Who I always still think of as Rita's ex-husband from Dexter which is also why I dislike him.)
Holli - I actually think you're onto something with the whole "leaving on the right heading" thing. I think we're meant to believe the heading you go in on determines when you come out. If it works in both directions, the sub idea would make perfect sense... almost.
The only thing that makes me wary of that theory is that going back 3 years wouldn't necessarily change the past... unless the bomb changed the past and they just go back to that past... I like it!
i didn't like this episode, but i'm hoping that it was designed to please a specific portion of the audience, much like this season gave people 2 answers to whether or not the bomb worked. i'm hoping the powers that be got their overt demigods at play stuff out of the way and we get a less fantastical finish to the season.
It's almost like they go out on a heading to sometime before they're all born and the zygots start over. It's a pretty crap idea, but it wouldn't surprise me if it's where we're heading. LOST Babies.
yeah, andrew., this episode seems like an information dump. if you like getting background information, it was pretty cool. if your more about the destination or the characters, i'd imagine you're disappointed.
i think, narratively, the fifth season needs to have a point. so, altiverse being any number of destinations if you take the wrong heading would invalidate the whole Jughead/season 5 thing.
i think that "we need to detonate Jughead" is Chekov's gun and the altiverse is the resulting use of said gun. and if you introduce a gun in the first act, it needs to go off in the third.
but i imagine there must be a story reason for it. like Izzy was checking in on Alpert. Charlie, Eko, and Ana Lucia were checking in on Hurley, etc. so, we're probably not getting a George Washington cameo.
it does stand to reason that there's some sort of ghosty afterlife either follows everyone in the LOST universe around all day or just follows Hurley.
thinking back on the times we've encountered Richard, i'm calling revisionist bullshit on this whole storyline. no dis on Nestor though. i thought he was great.
"Meh...I was expecting so much more because of all the hype."
Yup. Exactly the reason I was desperately avoiding spoilers and all the "this episode is going to be amazing!" talk.
I didn't have any expectations myself as I knew jack squat. But had I been expecting big things, 45 min of Richard crying to his wife and trying to break his chains would've been a massive let down.
I am borderline on this episode. It would've been a top 3 episode (after Flashes and the Constant) if it had more substance. They spent too much time on Richard trying to get out of his chains and pre-island. This would've been fine if it was a 2-hour episode, but sadly it was not.
Weird that no one else has talked about Hanso being the captain or questioned if Hurley was lying to Richard about Izzy saying the have to stop the Black Smoke.
There were so many things I noticed during this episode, I need to go back and take notes.
Did Smokey say something about Jacob taking his body and money?
After this episode Smokey stays the same in my book, Jacob is more evil, and Richard, though still clueless, gains points for his backstory.
What is with all this "this episode didn't do enough?" I agree that they could have spent less time with Richard in the bowels of the Black Rock, but I think this could easily have become a checklist episode where there was no heart to it. Then we'd all be complaining that it tried to do too much - lol. This ep made me CARE about Richard. Until now he was mysterious and represented all the stuff we wanted to know about the island and why people are there, and what its powers are (we assumed he was long-lived b/c of the island somehow, b4 we knew Jacob). But as Cuselof have said, the show is about characters and if Richard has something important to do b4 the end (which I'm guessing he does) having an episode that let's you inside his head and gives you emotional context for his actions is the most important objective here. It sounds like the writers failed to do that for some (as is to be expected) but it TOTALLY did it for me. I completely choked up during the Hurley 'Ghost' scene - but I'm a sap.i As far as getting answers goes - I'm really with Jordan at this point. I just want to see what happens. No doubt, when you've invested so much in something, expectations are normal, but ultimately self-defeating. Personally, I liked the wine bottle analogy and what it implies for where the story is going - I'm interested - but I'm not going to start predicting or hoping too much this close to the end. They've already written the end, so all there is to do is sit back and experience the ride. Kind of like the island - my experience is going to be determined by what I bring into it.
Geez - didn't realize I had a diatribe in me tonite.
So, the ship off-shore in scene 1 of the Incident was NOT The Black Rock (if I'm understanding right). Wonder if it'll be important or not.
Am I understanding correctly that the island is the cork in the bottle of evil which is Hell? It seems though, like Palmer said that 'Hell' is just being used as a metaphor. Jacob says "there are many other names for it, malevolence, evil, darkness". I doubt were going to get a more detailed description, though I totally agree that a shitload of people will now be dissatisfied with the ambiguity and call into Podcasts basing theories on Hell. The other thing that this ep showed me was again that Jacob and Flocke are NOT representations of good and evil. What it seems like is that they represent the Man of science/Man of Faith dichotomy. Jacob has faith in people to figure their shit out, and MiB doesn't see any proof of that so thinks its false. We can project our opinions on their actions and try and decide which one of them is the "good person" but I'm guessing TPTB are not going to nail it down for us.
I went into this episode with no expectations, i didn't even know who it was centric to, all I knew was the episode title and the translation of that.
But in terms of extended flashback episodes, this was probably my second favourite, behind Flashes Before Your Eyes and infront on The Other 48 Days and Meet Kevin Johnson.
I enjoyed it, but I think it spent a little too long in the Black Rock watching Ricardo struggle in his shackles... bit long spent there, I think.
Also. I hope we see some more of MIB (not Flocke, but the actual man), he was such a good actor in this episode. His face was so expressive, he was just a joy to watch. And it doesn't help that he's a massive Silve Fox DILF.
I like Lost. And Team Jacob FTW Odd theory I know but I feel like most of the episode was Isabella telling Richard's story to Hurley. Odd I know but, so am I.
¡Me gusta Lost! I like Lost, and I like Spanish! (I am a Spanish teacher when I am not thinking about Lost)
If anyone wanted to know what Hurley says to Isabella when Jack walks up on the beach:
"Yes. Yes, I can help, but I don't know how to find him..."
Nothing too interesting but nice to know for plot development.
Also the town that Richard is from is called Socorro, which means "help," or "assistance." Which of course what Richard needs for Isabella.
And maybe that is what Jacob had planned all along when he set into motion the events that led Richard to the island. Jacob wanted some "assistance" on the island.
If only Richard would have known ow "expensive" that medicine was going to be for him...
I am not good with Bible passages, but here also is Luke 4, which is what Richard was reading while waiting to be hanged:
24 And he said, Verily I say unto you, No prophet is accepted in his own country. .25 But I tell you of a truth, many widows were in Israel in the days of Elias, when the heaven was shut up three years and six months, when great famine was throughout all the land; 26 But unto none of them was Elias sent, save unto Sarepta [or"Zerepath], a city of Sidon, unto a woman that was a widow. .27 And many lepers were in Israel in the time of Eliseus the prophet; and none of them was cleansed, saving Naaman the Syrian.
Another number reference: 3 and 1/2 years= 42 months
Maybe this will all end 42 months from September 22, 2004?
Nice prediction - I like it. 42 months from Sep. 22, 2004 would be March 22, 2008 right? Let's see what happens.
I forgot to mention last night how much more rough Jacob was with Richard that he's been with anyone else (TWSS?), including his demeanor when they were talking - he did not come across as the gentle passive being we've seen. Example - when Ben came to kill him he didn't fight at all, but he laid some smack-down to Richard. Also my wife pointed out that (despite Jacob's manner) the head-dunking in the water was a bit like a (rough) baptism. I'm trying to decide if Jacob used to be less tempered in personality, of he was just having a bad day.
I've decided Jacob = Kate. Both think they are doing something nice for someone else - bring people to Island to have fresh start, kill dad who beats up mom. Yet both are totally wrong in terms of what the benefitee actually wants, i.e. not to be on a lunatic as-Island, for brutal husband to live.
it doesn't make sense to me why these guys are manipulating everyone. did you notice how the man in black tries to make richard think that jacob is evil, mirroring how jacob tries to convince everyone that the man in black is evil...
When will you feel like you'll want to know that information? After you watch the finale? I def wanna know...it's not like they'd spoil us on their podcast. I hope...
I haven't been able to avoid the titles the day the episodes air so far. Too internet dependent I guess, but I'd rather not know until much closer to time. It'll probably be something like "The End."
I'm just really trying to avoid anything that lets me speculate and thus over-speculate. Thanks for helping me out.
Holder - I wouldn't want to know the title of the finale until the week of. The only spoilers I used to follow were the episode titles. Now I even avoid them until the week of the episode.
I've been so paranoid about being spoiled that this is the only LOST related site (other than Lostpedia) that I visit anymore.
Also, I totally agree with Holli that it's not just about being spoiled, but over-theorizing. When I go into an episode with almost zero expectations about who or what it will be about, I tend to enjoy the episodes much more than if things don't turn out the way I was expecting.
About the Official LOST Podcast, I really appreciate the heads up about them revealing the finale title this week! Now I know to avoid that for the rest of the season too. While they've never truly spoiled anything with the OLP, they do give away a lot of information about the upcoming episode than I would rather not know.
I never listen to the OLP until one or two weeks after the pre-hashed episode. Now I'll have to avoid this new one too Joe until the end of the season.
Desmond is mirroring S2. He appeared in the first episode (truncated from 3 in the larger S2) and will reappear with a 2-hour long flash in the finale.
That's pure speculation and based on no kind of actual information.
In my rant in support of Ab Aeterno - I forgot to call shenanigans on the two-for-1 explanation of how the Black Rock smashed the statue and ended up inland. A tidal wave? really? But I suppose it's as believable as 72 people surviving the 815 crash.
I sought out the finale title. Kinda predictable. Nothing extraordinary.
I've been mulling over Ab Aeterno all day. I have mixed feelings. On one hand, Nestor Carbonell was great and the story was a great self-contained episode that confirmed answers. On the other, half the episode was Richard chained in the Black Rock. There was no peril for the character. We know he survived the smoke monster. I think I'm beginning to lower my expectations a bit. Or I'm learning to just accept whatever they give me.
Richard called the island hell so much, I'm worried that 90% of the audience is coming away from the episode convinced the island is hell. Most people don't pay close enough attention. Everything has to be blatantly spelled out for them.
Not only that Steph. But they played up the whole God/Devil allegory with Jacob and Anti-Jacob so much, I'm almost certain there are a lot of people thinking that.
PUNK'D! The Island Strikes Back What Kate Doesn't Entirely Worthwhile Doctor Who and the Silurians Charles Winmore Space: 1999 Anthony Cooper's Syncopated Style LOCKE Jacob's Bladder
Final line, Hurley wakes up in LA years later and says:
"Dude! I just realised that I never found out why that bird said my fucking name!"
Stop This Turtle, I Want To Get Off!!! Where Hurley Birds Dare Oh No Kate Din'nt! Jack's Tattoo, let us tell you about it Rosebud A Lost Wedding! Not In Cleveland Either If Not For You Meddling Kids Fallout Eloise The Rat In The 25th Century Fat Lady, Singing
HBO has bought the rights to (and so I imagine will be making the movie of)the book "Too Big To Fail: The Inside Story Of How Wall Street And Washington Fought To Save The System -- And Themselves."
the Tweet-verse has already casted the movie and TOQ got some love. no doubt he'd kill it (in the good sense). "Don't tell me what I can't do" would fit into the script perfectly I imagine.
- sure you've all heard about it already but 3 days before the finale, ABC & Damon & Carlton are hosting a "live" theater event. They will be at the New York Times Center and their discussion will be simulcast to movie theaters around the country (world?) The discussion will cover the making of the show with video clips & a 1-minute sneak peak at the finale. There will also be a Q&A with guests able to instant message questions.
Here's the story: http://aintitcool.com/node/44406 WARNING! i paraphrased it because the article unceremoniously spoils the title for the finale (which i had been avoiding, thanks jerks)
12-20 different podcasts is an estimate. Right now I'm backlogged with 52 individual podcasts, some that are over an hour, and some as short as a few minutes.
I get a lot of NPR podcasts. That's one of the reason I have so much backlog right now because there were lots of podcasts from SXSW.
I'm listening to about 4 LOST podcasts right now, but I'm subscribed to a handful of others that I usually end up deleting or skipping past most of the content. The Tuesday airdate has been largely responsible for that I think. When the podcasts don't show up until Monday before a new Tuesday show I'm much less likely to listen.
I also listen to Pausecast and Getting Cultured (though I'm behind on both). I listen to Confessions of an Internet Addict. And then there's about 3 general TV podcasts I listen to and ESPN College Football podcast. And The Bugle, The Moth and This American Life. And The Tribe.
Aimee be sure to comfort the "dreamy neighbor" after the Lakers crush the Thunder tonight.
Lol! The Thunder are really good and I like 'em (prob my 3rd favorite team after the Lakers and Nuggets). It's mainly cause you guys got my boy and fellow Bruin Russell Westbrook. Then you guys also get Eric Maynor from the Jazz. Not to mention Durant's a stud (in the basketball sense although he's a good looking dude too).
- jay/Jack lostiles black rock podcast transmission lost unlocked tli lost comm podcast official lost podcast bs report w bill simmons the I miss the dharmalars podcast
yea I can't stand Jacob. Don't like mib either. I like the 815ers
This is gonna be a little embarrassing - 32 podcasts. Though I DEFINITELY don't keep up with all of them:
- TLI (of course) - About the Music (Pat Metheny) - though It's sporadic (based I think on when he's got a new album/project) - Behind the Cutting Edge (Mr. Bill) - Bill Moyers Journal - Celebrity Playlist Podcast - though I really only listen to it when someone I'm interested in is doing it. - Confessions of an Internet Addict - Cue the Film - cute with chris (by Chris Leavins) - DWO Whocast (Doctor Who) - Doctor Who: Podshock - The Eleventh Hour Podcast (Doctor Who w/Chris JC and Corpsey - awaiting 1st ep. when the new season starts in a few weeks) - Geronimo Jack's Beard - Jacob's Cabin (Lost) - KCRW's Left, Right, and Center (politics roundtable) - KCRW's Le Show (Harry Shearer - though I've fallen off with this one - not sure why) - KCRW's The Treatment (good interview show with Film Directors - am way behind) - The Transmission - Mark and Brian Podcast (YES - I listen to a wacky morning show - so sue me) - Media Junkyard - NOVA Science Now - PAUSECAST - Getting Cultured - Real Time w/Bill Maher - SModcast - Stuff You Should Know (am REALLY liking this one but tend to listen to it in marathons) - The Dharmalars (I NEVER unsubscribed! Just in case - and, well, it's finally paying off :))) - Lost Podcast w/Jay and Jack - The Lostiles - The Official Lost Podcast - The Pop-Sci podcast (fallen off on this one too - got the message "iTunes has stopped updating b/c you have not listened to any episodes..." - This American Life - Today in the Past (John Hodgman - usually less than a minute long - each is a snippet of supposed historical fact but is ACTUALLY the pretty bizarre revisionist yet funny humor of Hodgman - probably not for everyone)
I found myself deleting most of the episodes of other LOST podcasts and now I really only regularly listen to TLI (although, I'd listen to a new Lostiles almost immediately), though my fondness for an occasional blast of LOST Unlocked is still there, even though I don't think they've gone under 2 hours in recent memory.
One of the reasons that I'm gonna attempt to keep The Eleventh Hour (despite the title) at somewhere around the 40 minute or less mark. Which will require immense self control.
Also, "a few weeks", MB? Try... NEXT FREAKING SATURDAY, DUDE!
I probably listen to about 40 podcasts. Thanks to all who still listen to my silly show.
A couple of Lost podcasts, TV Talk, Coverville, Firewall and Iceberg, a few Buffy podcasts, The Criterion Cast, /Film, Battleship Pretension, More than On Lesson, Previously On, Media Junkyard, Getting Cultured, PauseCast, Movies You May Have Missed, Movies You Should See, The Paul Goebel Show, The Totally Rad show, ZeroHour, a Supernatural podcast, and maybe a geek-related one here and there.
Jacob arranged for the statue to be destroyed but just leaving the one foot so that the percentage of the statue that was a thing that lacked toes was increased dramatically.
101 comments:
I can only imagine there aren't any comments because no one could pull themselves away from the TV.
What an incredibly well acted episode. I feel confident that the second half of this season is going to be mind-blowing and I feel a LOT better about the direction we're heading.
The wine bottle monologue was superb. I think Jacob and MiB's roles have been pretty clearly laid out and I can't wait to see how this plays out.
I like LOST.
Hurley = Whoopi Goldberg. Goodnight everyone. See you on the interwebs tomorrow.
And Hurley? The man was on screen for 5 minutes and KILLED it! Kudos Jorge!
I loved this episode! It made me think of when Smokey took on Eko, and Eko told him to FUCK OFF--I ain't doing your dirty work.
Plus, I saw how Smokey gets into your head, and how used Sayid and Richard to do his dirty work.
Too may thoughts to process....great job by Senor Richardo Alpert.
hmmmmmm
i thought purgatory was a theory they dismissed LONG ago?
great ep
LOL Jon, I thought the same thing about Hurley. He's Whoppi from Ghost.
This week's playlist: Unchained Melody
I didn't like it. There were a million commercials using up that extra 6 minutes apparently because there's just not that much to recap about V. The ultimate "answer" that Jacob will bring you to an Island to be brutalized by a Smoke Monster and die of thirst because he doesn't want to tell you right from wrong makes him as much a vindictive bastard as any MIB. The Island is Pandora's Box, but apparently without hope lurking in the the bottom of the MIB box. I don't care who wins. Maybe my only investment left is in the sideways world where the people who look like the characters I care about at least have some sort of chance to be something other than pawns.
Holli
The whole "island acting as a cork for the darkness" made me think of 28 Days Later... Gotta keep those hate-filled pseudo-zombies in check!
Holli - I can totally see where you're coming from. I think this episode is going to be on the extremes for a lot of people. I thought it was an excellent episode, but the wife hated it. She doesn't care about Jacob or MiB, so this episode was particularly frustrating for her.
I liked the Richard story in terms of giving us his background, but I really don't like where it's left us in terms of the mythology. I feel like I don't have a side to pull for. Jacob is a dick who brings people to the Island to die to prove a point, a point he's always failed to prove. MIB is "evil," but it doesn't really feel like a threat to me. In the meantime it leaves me feeling like the people I actually care about are nothing but pawns and I don't want any of them to have to suffer the fate of being stuck on the Island forever trapping Locke/MIB.
Holli
Ok, so if the alt universe happens, we all go to hell?
Meh...I was expecting so much more because of all the hype. Not that I didn't like the episode, but I did get my hope's up and I guess I was expecting more from Richard's backstory than 40 minutes of his wife and getting out of the ship.
And seriously? The ship destroyed the statue? I rolled my eyes and laughed. That must have been a big wave!
Darlton said many times that this episode was filled with answers. Answers that the other writers couldn't believe they wanted to spill so early in the season. I must have missed them...
hence why i think it will have a Babylon 5 ending. methinks the LOSTies will tell Jacob and Flockington to go fuck themselves. they're both demented assholes.
as an aside, they're not in hell. that was just Smokey pulling on Rico Suave's strings. but now we'll get the eight billion phone calls to every podcast about how they're dead and in hell.
as for holli, i think it's good that you're looking at both of them as douche bags. it'd be too easy for it to be cut and dry. sure, Flocke is chaotic and possibly evil but he's seemingly willing to give you what you want as a reward for helping him. and Jacob's trying to protect the world from Smokey but, oops, he's a pompous asshole who doesnt care who dies along the way.
which is really similar to Babylon 5. uh oh. there must be some other twist along the way.
"Ok, so if the alt universe happens, we all go to hell?"
no. :p
i think Jacob was saying that if Smokey gets loose, SHIT GOES DOWN. it'd be a bad scene, as the kids are fond of saying. he'd wreak havoc.
and he was saying if Smokey got loose. not (necessarily) if the Alt Universe happens.
but, man, there's got to be a point to the alti-verse. btw, no alti-verse! w00t?
how'd you like the Ricardus music?
and back to steph, i dont know. maybe you're right. but i got the impression that every hell mentioned was a metaphor and or a manipulative lie that also happened to be a metaphor.
as for the statue, maybe it's not solid rock? the colussus was bronze or something, right?
I knew there was a reason I didn't watch Babylon 5.
Yeah, at this point I guess we all need to be on Team Sawyer hijacking the sub. Hey, maybe that's what the alt-world is. Sawyer and everyone takes the sub on the wrong heading and comes out in X world where dead people who aren't on the sub are now on a plane. Okay it needs some work.
I don't understand why Flocke can't leave if Jacob's dead. I guess it has to do with candidates still being alive, but that's such another douchy Jacob cheat. I'll put a bunch of people on a cave wall/lighthouse wheel and unless someone other than you kills them then you're stuck. Neener, neener, neener.
It also feels like Jacob trapped MIB like trapping a genie in a bottle which also feels like not playing fair. Screw you Jacob. (Who I always still think of as Rita's ex-husband from Dexter which is also why I dislike him.)
Holli
Holli - I actually think you're onto something with the whole "leaving on the right heading" thing. I think we're meant to believe the heading you go in on determines when you come out. If it works in both directions, the sub idea would make perfect sense... almost.
The only thing that makes me wary of that theory is that going back 3 years wouldn't necessarily change the past... unless the bomb changed the past and they just go back to that past... I like it!
i didn't like this episode, but i'm hoping that it was designed to please a specific portion of the audience, much like this season gave people 2 answers to whether or not the bomb worked. i'm hoping the powers that be got their overt demigods at play stuff out of the way and we get a less fantastical finish to the season.
It's almost like they go out on a heading to sometime before they're all born and the zygots start over. It's a pretty crap idea, but it wouldn't surprise me if it's where we're heading. LOST Babies.
Holli
yeah, andrew., this episode seems like an information dump. if you like getting background information, it was pretty cool. if your more about the destination or the characters, i'd imagine you're disappointed.
it was sort of backstory/continuity porn.
So Hurley can talk to any dead person in the history of the world anytime anywhere? His power kicks Miles' ass.
Holli
i think, narratively, the fifth season needs to have a point. so, altiverse being any number of destinations if you take the wrong heading would invalidate the whole Jughead/season 5 thing.
i think that "we need to detonate Jughead" is Chekov's gun and the altiverse is the resulting use of said gun. and if you introduce a gun in the first act, it needs to go off in the third.
holli, yes.
but i imagine there must be a story reason for it. like Izzy was checking in on Alpert. Charlie, Eko, and Ana Lucia were checking in on Hurley, etc. so, we're probably not getting a George Washington cameo.
it does stand to reason that there's some sort of ghosty afterlife either follows everyone in the LOST universe around all day or just follows Hurley.
Ghost-Isabelle is watching you use the bathroom.
and, yes, the behind the scenes reason is "because its cool." :p
No George Washington?!? Well, damn.
Holli
thinking back on the times we've encountered Richard, i'm calling revisionist bullshit on this whole storyline.
no dis on Nestor though. i thought he was great.
"Meh...I was expecting so much more because of all the hype."
Yup. Exactly the reason I was desperately avoiding spoilers and all the "this episode is going to be amazing!" talk.
I didn't have any expectations myself as I knew jack squat. But had I been expecting big things, 45 min of Richard crying to his wife and trying to break his chains would've been a massive let down.
It saddens me to say Hurley must die.
I am borderline on this episode. It would've been a top 3 episode (after Flashes and the Constant) if it had more substance. They spent too much time on Richard trying to get out of his chains and pre-island. This would've been fine if it was a 2-hour episode, but sadly it was not.
Weird that no one else has talked about Hanso being the captain or questioned if Hurley was lying to Richard about Izzy saying the have to stop the Black Smoke.
There were so many things I noticed during this episode, I need to go back and take notes.
Did Smokey say something about Jacob taking his body and money?
After this episode Smokey stays the same in my book, Jacob is more evil, and Richard, though still clueless, gains points for his backstory.
I really hope we get a smoke monster episode.
Maybe the finale or episode before the finale.
The island is an evil Butt Plug!! NICE!
Loved that episode a lot!!
What is with all this "this episode didn't do enough?" I agree that they could have spent less time with Richard in the bowels of the Black Rock, but I think this could easily have become a checklist episode where there was no heart to it. Then we'd all be complaining that it tried to do too much - lol. This ep made me CARE about Richard. Until now he was mysterious and represented all the stuff we wanted to know about the island and why people are there, and what its powers are (we assumed he was long-lived b/c of the island somehow, b4 we knew Jacob). But as Cuselof have said, the show is about characters and if Richard has something important to do b4 the end (which I'm guessing he does) having an episode that let's you inside his head and gives you emotional context for his actions is the most important objective here. It sounds like the writers failed to do that for some (as is to be expected) but it TOTALLY did it for me. I completely choked up during the Hurley 'Ghost' scene - but I'm a sap.i
As far as getting answers goes - I'm really with Jordan at this point. I just want to see what happens. No doubt, when you've invested so much in something, expectations are normal, but ultimately self-defeating. Personally, I liked the wine bottle analogy and what it implies for where the story is going - I'm interested - but I'm not going to start predicting or hoping too much this close to the end. They've already written the end, so all there is to do is sit back and experience the ride. Kind of like the island - my experience is going to be determined by what I bring into it.
Geez - didn't realize I had a diatribe in me tonite.
So, the ship off-shore in scene 1 of the Incident was NOT The Black Rock (if I'm understanding right). Wonder if it'll be important or not.
Am I understanding correctly that the island is the cork in the bottle of evil which is Hell? It seems though, like Palmer said that 'Hell' is just being used as a metaphor. Jacob says "there are many other names for it, malevolence, evil, darkness". I doubt were going to get a more detailed description, though I totally agree that a shitload of people will now be dissatisfied with the ambiguity and call into Podcasts basing theories on Hell.
The other thing that this ep showed me was again that Jacob and Flocke are NOT representations of good and evil. What it seems like is that they represent the Man of science/Man of Faith dichotomy. Jacob has faith in people to figure their shit out, and MiB doesn't see any proof of that so thinks its false. We can project our opinions on their actions and try and decide which one of them is the "good person" but I'm guessing TPTB are not going to nail it down for us.
All right. Eyes are starting to close. Nite.
I went into this episode with no expectations, i didn't even know who it was centric to, all I knew was the episode title and the translation of that.
But in terms of extended flashback episodes, this was probably my second favourite, behind Flashes Before Your Eyes and infront on The Other 48 Days and Meet Kevin Johnson.
I enjoyed it, but I think it spent a little too long in the Black Rock watching Ricardo struggle in his shackles... bit long spent there, I think.
Also. I hope we see some more of MIB (not Flocke, but the actual man), he was such a good actor in this episode. His face was so expressive, he was just a joy to watch. And it doesn't help that he's a massive Silve Fox DILF.
Ahem
I like Lost. And Team Jacob FTW Odd theory I know but I feel like most of the episode was Isabella telling Richard's story to Hurley. Odd I know but, so am I.
A virtual present for the blogspot
Holli
oh man. those flowers look GOOOOOOOD. :)
Fuck Jacob, Fuck Black Shirt. HUMANS RULE!!
I am on Team Human Beings!!
¡Me gusta Lost! I like Lost, and I like Spanish! (I am a Spanish teacher when I am not thinking about Lost)
If anyone wanted to know what Hurley says to Isabella when Jack walks up on the beach:
"Yes. Yes, I can help, but I don't know how to find him..."
Nothing too interesting but nice to know for plot development.
Also the town that Richard is from is called Socorro, which means "help," or "assistance." Which of course what Richard needs for Isabella.
And maybe that is what Jacob had planned all along when he set into motion the events that led Richard to the island. Jacob wanted some "assistance" on the island.
If only Richard would have known ow "expensive" that medicine was going to be for him...
I meant "how" 'expensive'
I am not good with Bible passages, but here also is Luke 4, which is what Richard was reading while waiting to be hanged:
24 And he said, Verily I say unto you, No prophet is accepted in his own country.
.25 But I tell you of a truth, many widows were in Israel in the days of Elias, when the heaven was shut up three years and six months, when great famine was throughout all the land;
26 But unto none of them was Elias sent, save unto Sarepta [or"Zerepath], a city of Sidon, unto a woman that was a widow.
.27 And many lepers were in Israel in the time of Eliseus the prophet; and none of them was cleansed, saving Naaman the Syrian.
Another number reference:
3 and 1/2 years= 42 months
Maybe this will all end 42 months from September 22, 2004?
Nice prediction - I like it. 42 months from Sep. 22, 2004 would be March 22, 2008 right? Let's see what happens.
I forgot to mention last night how much more rough Jacob was with Richard that he's been with anyone else (TWSS?), including his demeanor when they were talking - he did not come across as the gentle passive being we've seen. Example - when Ben came to kill him he didn't fight at all, but he laid some smack-down to Richard. Also my wife pointed out that (despite Jacob's manner) the head-dunking in the water was a bit like a (rough) baptism. I'm trying to decide if Jacob used to be less tempered in personality, of he was just having a bad day.
I've decided Jacob = Kate. Both think they are doing something nice for someone else - bring people to Island to have fresh start, kill dad who beats up mom. Yet both are totally wrong in terms of what the benefitee actually wants, i.e. not to be on a lunatic as-Island, for brutal husband to live.
Holli
Michael Emerson injured while filming!
it doesn't make sense to me why these guys are manipulating everyone. did you notice how the man in black tries to make richard think that jacob is evil, mirroring how jacob tries to convince everyone that the man in black is evil...
I don't know what to think!! AHHHH
lex, right on! jacob and smokey are both douches! douche-island. those jerks.
steph, that must've hurt. but i guess better that than a dagger accident or something. yowzahs!
Darlton is revealing the finale title in their next podcast. If you learn it, please don't put it here. I don't want to know.
Holli
When will you feel like you'll want to know that information? After you watch the finale? I def wanna know...it's not like they'd spoil us on their podcast. I hope...
I haven't been able to avoid the titles the day the episodes air so far. Too internet dependent I guess, but I'd rather not know until much closer to time. It'll probably be something like "The End."
I'm just really trying to avoid anything that lets me speculate and thus over-speculate. Thanks for helping me out.
Holli
it'd be awesome if the title for the finale were "It's All Been in a Virtual Reality Controlled By Aliens."
;)
Aliens Looking In a Snow Globe As They Awaken From A Dream.
Holli
Holder - I wouldn't want to know the title of the finale until the week of. The only spoilers I used to follow were the episode titles. Now I even avoid them until the week of the episode.
I've been so paranoid about being spoiled that this is the only LOST related site (other than Lostpedia) that I visit anymore.
Also, I totally agree with Holli that it's not just about being spoiled, but over-theorizing. When I go into an episode with almost zero expectations about who or what it will be about, I tend to enjoy the episodes much more than if things don't turn out the way I was expecting.
About the Official LOST Podcast, I really appreciate the heads up about them revealing the finale title this week! Now I know to avoid that for the rest of the season too. While they've never truly spoiled anything with the OLP, they do give away a lot of information about the upcoming episode than I would rather not know.
I never listen to the OLP until one or two weeks after the pre-hashed episode. Now I'll have to avoid this new one too Joe until the end of the season.
Holli
I'm thinking Die Together or Live Alone.
Wait no! The Pilot, emphasis on the.
I think THIS picture will now be my sole online response to people who p*ss me off.
/FYI - this is not meant to imply any or you - none of you lovely people p*ss me off :)
Drink Together, Dine Alone
Where the FUCK is Desmond? This is seriously starting to piss me off.
He better be what's on the sub and he better be on the show for the rest of the season unlike what they did last year.
Desmond is mirroring S2. He appeared in the first episode (truncated from 3 in the larger S2) and will reappear with a 2-hour long flash in the finale.
That's pure speculation and based on no kind of actual information.
Holli
In my rant in support of Ab Aeterno - I forgot to call shenanigans on the two-for-1 explanation of how the Black Rock smashed the statue and ended up inland. A tidal wave? really? But I suppose it's as believable as 72 people surviving the 815 crash.
hahaha omg, i just got spoiled on the series finale title on twitter.
It seems apt.
no shit ThaKid
There is NO WAY Des is not hugely important to the endgame of this thing
I sought out the finale title. Kinda predictable. Nothing extraordinary.
I've been mulling over Ab Aeterno all day. I have mixed feelings. On one hand, Nestor Carbonell was great and the story was a great self-contained episode that confirmed answers. On the other, half the episode was Richard chained in the Black Rock. There was no peril for the character. We know he survived the smoke monster. I think I'm beginning to lower my expectations a bit. Or I'm learning to just accept whatever they give me.
Richard called the island hell so much, I'm worried that 90% of the audience is coming away from the episode convinced the island is hell. Most people don't pay close enough attention. Everything has to be blatantly spelled out for them.
Not only that Steph. But they played up the whole God/Devil allegory with Jacob and Anti-Jacob so much, I'm almost certain there are a lot of people thinking that.
Is it Sunday yet, Jordan?
Need to get you watching The Wire next. ;)
Watching my box set of The Wire -Season 1 is just about my first priority after Lost ends.
Finale Title Predictions:
PUNK'D!
The Island Strikes Back
What Kate Doesn't
Entirely Worthwhile
Doctor Who and the Silurians
Charles Winmore
Space: 1999
Anthony Cooper's Syncopated Style
LOCKE
Jacob's Bladder
Final line, Hurley wakes up in LA years later and says:
"Dude! I just realised that I never found out why that bird said my fucking name!"
(and thud?)
Suck it Jacob
Exposé 2: Zombie Boogaloo
Even Stranger in a Strange Land
Enter 7-11
BogDown
The Male Ballerina
Flushes Before Your Eyes
Tricia Tanaka is Still Dead
Green Eggs and Ham Town
Meat: Kevin's Johnson
and my number one choice... KA-BLAMO!!!
Stop This Turtle, I Want To Get Off!!!
Where Hurley Birds Dare
Oh No Kate Din'nt!
Jack's Tattoo, let us tell you about it
Rosebud
A Lost Wedding!
Not In Cleveland Either
If Not For You Meddling Kids
Fallout
Eloise The Rat In The 25th Century
Fat Lady, Singing
HBO has bought the rights to (and so I imagine will be making the movie of)the book "Too Big To Fail: The Inside Story Of How Wall Street And Washington Fought To Save The System -- And Themselves."
the Tweet-verse has already casted the movie and TOQ got some love. no doubt he'd kill it (in the good sense). "Don't tell me what I can't do" would fit into the script perfectly I imagine.
Something that I finally realized today... My english classroom is 108. Does the fact that it's March and I just realized this make me a bad Lost fan?
is it your fourth class of the day? are there 23 students?
- sure you've all heard about it already but 3 days before the finale, ABC & Damon & Carlton are hosting a "live" theater event. They will be at the New York Times Center and their discussion will be simulcast to movie theaters around the country (world?)
The discussion will cover the making of the show with video clips & a 1-minute sneak peak at the finale. There will also be a Q&A with guests able to instant message questions.
Here's the story: http://aintitcool.com/node/44406
WARNING! i paraphrased it because the article unceremoniously spoils the title for the finale (which i had been avoiding, thanks jerks)
New King of Kong
Holli
steph- i just realized while watching the previously on supernatural, that both jacob and mib have been on supernatural.
Yes Ally! Ryan, don't click. You will be spoiled.
Happy birthday to me. I get a Lost Live Event.
In case anyone is interested...
Rebecca Mader explains how LOST will end.
Don't worry... Absolutely ZERO spoilers (unless you've been wondering what Chris Hardwick is up to).
Good King of Kong post, Holli, but my eyes couldn't help but wander to the link for T&T&A= Spicy Food & Sexy Ladies.
Is there a sexy lady/bacon product slide? No idea - I haven't looked.
(translation: the wife's not gone to work yet)
just listened to the official lost podcast ... they said something about jacob being a liar. hmmmm
Yeah, and the finale title is freakin crazy mindblowing. Or not.
please dont spoil the finale title yet. It should be Found or Destiny or It Only Ends Once
netflix streaming on the wii. besides sounding sort of like a VD, it works pretty well. good stuff.
i am woefully behind on podcasts (besides TLI). oops.
quick poll, how many podcasts do you people listen to?
12-20 different podcasts is an estimate. Right now I'm backlogged with 52 individual podcasts, some that are over an hour, and some as short as a few minutes.
Holli
wow, that's loads. I only have 6 podcast subscriptions... One of which will finish soon. I'm looking at you, TLI.
Other than one that is updated daily, the rest only air when the TV show they're about is on.
Kyle from Kentucky,
Enjoy a platonic slap on the ass from Tha Kid a.k.a. the #1 Anti-Jacobite
Also. . .
I know TLI is going to Vegas for "Viva Lost Vegas," but is anyone coming to LA for the Jay and Jack thing?
17 podcasts
(7 Lost related)
(3 Chuck related)
(3 Batman related)
The rest are random.
I get a lot of NPR podcasts. That's one of the reason I have so much backlog right now because there were lots of podcasts from SXSW.
I'm listening to about 4 LOST podcasts right now, but I'm subscribed to a handful of others that I usually end up deleting or skipping past most of the content. The Tuesday airdate has been largely responsible for that I think. When the podcasts don't show up until Monday before a new Tuesday show I'm much less likely to listen.
I also listen to Pausecast and Getting Cultured (though I'm behind on both). I listen to Confessions of an Internet Addict. And then there's about 3 general TV podcasts I listen to and ESPN College Football podcast. And The Bugle, The Moth and This American Life. And The Tribe.
Holli
Last thing. . .
Aimee be sure to comfort the "dreamy neighbor" after the Lakers crush the Thunder tonight.
Lol! The Thunder are really good and I like 'em (prob my 3rd favorite team after the Lakers and Nuggets). It's mainly cause you guys got my boy and fellow Bruin Russell Westbrook. Then you guys also get Eric Maynor from the Jazz. Not to mention Durant's a stud (in the basketball sense although he's a good looking dude too).
I love the Thunder. Durant is a man. And westbrook has played out of his mind most of the year
TLI
GJ's Beard
Jay and Jack
Official LOST Podcast
The Smoke Hatch
Rethinking Lost
That's What She Said (the office)
B.S. Report with Bill Simmons (sports)
Go Hawks.
- jay/Jack
lostiles
black rock podcast
transmission
lost unlocked
tli
lost comm podcast
official lost podcast
bs report w bill simmons
the I miss the dharmalars podcast
yea I can't stand Jacob. Don't like mib either. I like the 815ers
This is gonna be a little embarrassing - 32 podcasts. Though I DEFINITELY don't keep up with all of them:
- TLI (of course)
- About the Music (Pat Metheny) - though It's sporadic (based I think on when he's got a new album/project)
- Behind the Cutting Edge (Mr. Bill)
- Bill Moyers Journal
- Celebrity Playlist Podcast - though I really only listen to it when someone I'm interested in is doing it.
- Confessions of an Internet Addict
- Cue the Film
- cute with chris (by Chris Leavins)
- DWO Whocast (Doctor Who)
- Doctor Who: Podshock
- The Eleventh Hour Podcast (Doctor Who w/Chris JC and Corpsey - awaiting 1st ep. when the new season starts in a few weeks)
- Geronimo Jack's Beard
- Jacob's Cabin (Lost)
- KCRW's Left, Right, and Center (politics roundtable)
- KCRW's Le Show (Harry Shearer - though I've fallen off with this one - not sure why)
- KCRW's The Treatment (good interview show with Film Directors - am way behind)
- The Transmission
- Mark and Brian Podcast (YES - I listen to a wacky morning show - so sue me)
- Media Junkyard
- NOVA Science Now
- PAUSECAST
- Getting Cultured
- Real Time w/Bill Maher
- SModcast
- Stuff You Should Know (am REALLY liking this one but tend to listen to it in marathons)
- The Dharmalars (I NEVER unsubscribed! Just in case - and, well, it's finally paying off :)))
- Lost Podcast w/Jay and Jack
- The Lostiles
- The Official Lost Podcast
- The Pop-Sci podcast (fallen off on this one too - got the message "iTunes has stopped updating b/c you have not listened to any episodes..."
- This American Life
- Today in the Past (John Hodgman - usually less than a minute long - each is a snippet of supposed historical fact but is ACTUALLY the pretty bizarre revisionist yet funny humor of Hodgman - probably not for everyone)
I used to listen to Today in the Past, but it got annoying and I unsubscribed.
Holli
I found myself deleting most of the episodes of other LOST podcasts and now I really only regularly listen to TLI (although, I'd listen to a new Lostiles almost immediately), though my fondness for an occasional blast of LOST Unlocked is still there, even though I don't think they've gone under 2 hours in recent memory.
One of the reasons that I'm gonna attempt to keep The Eleventh Hour (despite the title) at somewhere around the 40 minute or less mark. Which will require immense self control.
Also, "a few weeks", MB? Try... NEXT FREAKING SATURDAY, DUDE!
I probably listen to about 40 podcasts. Thanks to all who still listen to my silly show.
A couple of Lost podcasts, TV Talk, Coverville, Firewall and Iceberg, a few Buffy podcasts, The Criterion Cast, /Film, Battleship Pretension, More than On Lesson, Previously On, Media Junkyard, Getting Cultured, PauseCast, Movies You May Have Missed, Movies You Should See, The Paul Goebel Show, The Totally Rad show, ZeroHour, a Supernatural podcast, and maybe a geek-related one here and there.
Damn, I already have the bracket challenge wrapped up. Nice.
He is also lactose intolerant.
He hates things that lack toes - like the statue.
Jacob arranged for the statue to be destroyed but just leaving the one foot so that the percentage of the statue that was a thing that lacked toes was increased dramatically.
i propose a 'Jacob Is An Asshole' TLI shirt.
if i had any artistic ability, i'd mock one up. but, uh, not so much...
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